Wisdom vs Stupidity: 2 videos

Two brief lectures, one from a Hawaiian polytheist and conservationist, and the other from an American Christian and fundamentalist. Even though the Hawaiian was colonized (and he mentions this in his lecture), he never displays the domineering and scoffing attitude of the Christian. This is to say nothing of the vast difference of the theories they are promoting and the information they are using concerning sustainability…

8 thoughts on “Wisdom vs Stupidity: 2 videos

    1. Melas the Hellene Post author

      Indeed. Only a hypocritical religion like Christianity could in the same breath promise absolute domination and global happiness. I always thought the idea of a Messiah for the Jews (the ancient ones at least) was far more reasonable because of their desire for liberation; that’s why the Jewish Messiah is a violent warrior rather than a wolf in sheep’s clothing. The Christians can wait for their happy hour as long as they wish, because it won’t come and every moment declines their numbers.

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      1. K

        I don’t like Judaism either, but on many points it is better or at least more reasonable than Christianity. Adopting the Christian ethic in full is a route to suicide. You can’t defend yourself or your place in the world, you just sit and wait, turning the other cheek. The Jews have a more balanced view of this. It also took Christians to come up with the idea of infant damnation. The Jews contributed their fanatical intolerance and arrogance to Christianity, but the Christians managed to outdo them in many areas.

        The messiah idea is very attractive. I have seen people wishing for someone to come along and solve their problems often enough. One day, some day, some hero or god will come along and fix all your problems, all you have to do is sit and believe. It is so easy. That is why the idea spread. Even in China variants of it have popped up in religions that formed during times of dynastic decline. The Jews were always down on their luck, but were also ambitious, so it naturally appealed to them. There is some debate about whether or not they got it from the Zoroastrian Saoshyant idea, which is also messianic and apocalyptic in nature. The later version of it has him as a descendant of Zoroaster that will be born of a virgin. They even have the idea of multiple saoshyants like the Jews had the idea of multiple messiahs.

        I could not think of much to say with that first comment. It has been a while, and I had just gotten back from work. I was far too drained to address something by Kent Hovind with anything but sarcasm. I know Kent Hovind well, my uncle used to listen to and watch his material. When I was younger I used to sit with him and pick at Hovind’s arguments, while he would try to come up with counterarguments. At least my uncle would listen to me, and not immediately shut me down. Putting Hovind up against that Sam Ohu is hardly a fair fight. That short video makes several good points. If the Hawaiian islands are just 3 weeks from famine conditions, that is hardly freedom or independence that Americans like to tout. I had already read about some of the things he mentioned, since I have some books on Hawaiian culture and history. The kahunas put kapu on certain fishing spots and areas seasonally to make sure that there would be food next year. Much of their system was very sensible for their history and environment. Have you ever heard of the massive upheaval that was caused by Christians among the elite when they announced the end of the traditional rules and mores of Hawaiian society? There was a period of antinomian madness, because to Hawaiians it was like everything stopped making sense.

        The linear view of the world, the Christian prototype of secular progressivism, and Christian eschatology are the reasons why you see so many Americans scoff at the idea of sustainability or limits to growth. I have seen this even in those who are not religious, it permeates American society. I think it is a flight from reality. Nothing is free, there are limits to growth, and no one is going to save us from the consequences of our own actions. For the secular, the messiah coming back is simply replaced with some imagined technological miracle that will happen in the future to make things work just as they do no, or better. I expect a great deal of trouble ahead.

        Liked by 3 people

      2. Melas the Hellene Post author

        I’m glad to see you have returned after a sojourn. The Christian ethic of turning the other cheek has actually (and unfortunately) proven far more successful than we might think. There was cunning and calculation in it towards a particular result. At first the Christians were perhaps not too much to blame because of the imperial depravity of Rome, but when the Christians took the imperial throne, they became no better. It is somewhat different with the Jews, owing to different circumstances, but there are similarities.

        The idea of a Messiah, in the original Jewish form, seems to be not so singular. When people are somehow oppressed or in need of a victory, they hope or pray for a mighty warlord to drive away the enemy and end the shame. A larger worldview and grievance stretches the notion further to universality. The scope of “the world” to the early Jews was Canaan, to the later Hellenistic Jews was the Levant, to the early Christians was the whole Roman Empire, and to the later Christians the whole globe. This is how the Messiah degenerated from a regional hero and savior (not too different from the likes of Vencingetorix or Arminius) to a spiritual emperor.

        Hovind seems to have a good command of rhetorical tropes and probably does his work satisfactorily for his audience. I presented his piece because I thought it was a striking instance of Christian close-mindedness and lust for domination. Ohu offered a contrast that was worth attention and admiration. The notion of the human realm and the divine realm within the same environment was beautiful. I am glad you have further knowledge about Hawaii that I lack. I had not known about the Christian disordering of the island, but is not surprising to me.

        Your final paragraph is very well stated, particularly the secularization of the messiah in terms of technology. Let us hope we polytheists can take advantage of the technology and raise our own leaders for a good cause.

        Liked by 2 people

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